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	<title>Comments on: On North Korea, Bush has one last chance not to go out with a whimper.</title>
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	<link>http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/</link>
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		<title>By: usinkorea</title>
		<link>http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/comment-page-1/#comment-59408</link>
		<dc:creator>usinkorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:27:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/#comment-59408</guid>
		<description>I was just thinking --- Who would have thought 2 or 3 years ago that Iraq (and Afghanistan) would be the positive Bush legacy items and North Korea a bigger stain?

I&#039;m sure some readers, and a whole lot in cyberspace, would scoff at the idea either of the first two nations mentioned are anything but huge Bush scandals, but history will be much more kind than the American press and current crop of academics and the society they influence.

Afghanistan is the more questionable item - but - history will inevitably compare the US-led war in Afghanistan with that of the Russians.  That was also the warning lesson that rightfully scared many, especially in the press, immediately after 9/11.  

But, the Taliban and supporters crumbled with remarkable speed.  The nation is still a critical mess, but it surely has not been the Soviet experience.   And whether or not Afghanistan remains the same as now, rebuilds, or deteriorates, Bush&#039;s legacy will likely be one of quick victory and years of relative stability if not great gains in the nation-building department.

In Iraq, two or three years ago, we actually had politicians and news people saying the war was unwinable and wondering how we would get ourselves out and if it would be as big a national shame and as bloody as Vietnam.

The fact the media can&#039;t remember there is a state called Iraq lets us know how greatly things have changed.

Bush&#039;s long-term legacy on Iraq is much more dependent on future progress than with Afghanistan, but the amount of turn around in the violence and stability is remarkable, and history will note that.

On NK --- history might end up saying what several here have been saying all along:  That the administration had doggedly worked to tighten up on Pyongyang over a period of years - finally getting China to go along with imposing measures that really cut into the regime&#039;s money supply and thus its ability to survive ---- but then buckled under the intense domestic and international pressure (and events on the ground) concerning Iraq.

Nobody would have predicted this ending three years ago...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was just thinking &#8212; Who would have thought 2 or 3 years ago that Iraq (and Afghanistan) would be the positive Bush legacy items and North Korea a bigger stain?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure some readers, and a whole lot in cyberspace, would scoff at the idea either of the first two nations mentioned are anything but huge Bush scandals, but history will be much more kind than the American press and current crop of academics and the society they influence.</p>
<p>Afghanistan is the more questionable item &#8211; but &#8211; history will inevitably compare the US-led war in Afghanistan with that of the Russians.  That was also the warning lesson that rightfully scared many, especially in the press, immediately after 9/11.  </p>
<p>But, the Taliban and supporters crumbled with remarkable speed.  The nation is still a critical mess, but it surely has not been the Soviet experience.   And whether or not Afghanistan remains the same as now, rebuilds, or deteriorates, Bush&#8217;s legacy will likely be one of quick victory and years of relative stability if not great gains in the nation-building department.</p>
<p>In Iraq, two or three years ago, we actually had politicians and news people saying the war was unwinable and wondering how we would get ourselves out and if it would be as big a national shame and as bloody as Vietnam.</p>
<p>The fact the media can&#8217;t remember there is a state called Iraq lets us know how greatly things have changed.</p>
<p>Bush&#8217;s long-term legacy on Iraq is much more dependent on future progress than with Afghanistan, but the amount of turn around in the violence and stability is remarkable, and history will note that.</p>
<p>On NK &#8212; history might end up saying what several here have been saying all along:  That the administration had doggedly worked to tighten up on Pyongyang over a period of years &#8211; finally getting China to go along with imposing measures that really cut into the regime&#8217;s money supply and thus its ability to survive &#8212;- but then buckled under the intense domestic and international pressure (and events on the ground) concerning Iraq.</p>
<p>Nobody would have predicted this ending three years ago&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: J</title>
		<link>http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/comment-page-1/#comment-59331</link>
		<dc:creator>J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 19:19:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/#comment-59331</guid>
		<description>Not sure if you&#039;ve already heard, but Richard Cizik resigned from his post at the National Association of Evangelicals.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/12/washington/12brfs-EVANGELICALL_BRF.html?scp=1&amp;sq=cizik&amp;st=cse

Another sad day for North Koreans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure if you&#8217;ve already heard, but Richard Cizik resigned from his post at the National Association of Evangelicals.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/12/washington/12brfs-EVANGELICALL_BRF.html?scp=1&#038;sq=cizik&#038;st=cse" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/12/washington/12brfs-EVANGELICALL_BRF.html?scp=1&#038;sq=cizik&#038;st=cse</a></p>
<p>Another sad day for North Koreans.</p>
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		<title>By: usinkorea</title>
		<link>http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/comment-page-1/#comment-59329</link>
		<dc:creator>usinkorea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 18:56:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/#comment-59329</guid>
		<description>I saw an article today that said the US was threatening to cut off fuel oil shipments to go along with the food aid move.

A month before Bush leaves and Obama takes over - to put in a new team - is no time for Hill to grow a pair of balls.   

People involved in these things should take a close look at this.  Go back to what was going on before Bush gave Hill the nod to shape policy - look at what had been going on just before then and up to then - then look at what Hill had to say (and the media) about why changes were needed (away from the &quot;do nothing&quot; Bush policy) - and then compare it to what Hill and company are now threatening to do ---- at the tail-end of the Bush administration.

The media loved to talk about how Bush was wasting time and &quot;doing nothing.&quot;

Well --- maybe some of these people can now admit - Hill has been wasting our time after tossing out measures that were showing signs of making Pyongyang highly uncomfortable and looking for some way out.

---- Unfortunately for all by Pyongyang, Hill let them out to a significant extent.

(And none of this is new ---- we see this time and time again.....)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I saw an article today that said the US was threatening to cut off fuel oil shipments to go along with the food aid move.</p>
<p>A month before Bush leaves and Obama takes over &#8211; to put in a new team &#8211; is no time for Hill to grow a pair of balls.   </p>
<p>People involved in these things should take a close look at this.  Go back to what was going on before Bush gave Hill the nod to shape policy &#8211; look at what had been going on just before then and up to then &#8211; then look at what Hill had to say (and the media) about why changes were needed (away from the &#8220;do nothing&#8221; Bush policy) &#8211; and then compare it to what Hill and company are now threatening to do &#8212;- at the tail-end of the Bush administration.</p>
<p>The media loved to talk about how Bush was wasting time and &#8220;doing nothing.&#8221;</p>
<p>Well &#8212; maybe some of these people can now admit &#8211; Hill has been wasting our time after tossing out measures that were showing signs of making Pyongyang highly uncomfortable and looking for some way out.</p>
<p>&#8212;- Unfortunately for all by Pyongyang, Hill let them out to a significant extent.</p>
<p>(And none of this is new &#8212;- we see this time and time again&#8230;..)</p>
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		<title>By: Wolmae</title>
		<link>http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/comment-page-1/#comment-59325</link>
		<dc:creator>Wolmae</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 16:39:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://freekorea.us/2008/12/12/on-north-korea-bush-has-one-last-chance-not-to-go-out-with-a-whimper/#comment-59325</guid>
		<description>South Korean hardliners appreciate former President Jimmy Carter for meeting with Kim Il Sung in Pyongyang in mid-June, 1994.  Whatever the circumstance may have been (heart attack due to excessive excitement? regicide?), Carter&#039;s embrace of the Great Leader led to the latter&#039;s death three weeks later.  Some even call Carter &quot;messenger of death.&quot;

Send another high-profile American back to Pyongyang to meet the ailing Dear Leader, if only to ascertain how sick he really is.  With any luck, the trip may yet again bring--closure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>South Korean hardliners appreciate former President Jimmy Carter for meeting with Kim Il Sung in Pyongyang in mid-June, 1994.  Whatever the circumstance may have been (heart attack due to excessive excitement? regicide?), Carter&#8217;s embrace of the Great Leader led to the latter&#8217;s death three weeks later.  Some even call Carter &#8220;messenger of death.&#8221;</p>
<p>Send another high-profile American back to Pyongyang to meet the ailing Dear Leader, if only to ascertain how sick he really is.  With any luck, the trip may yet again bring&#8211;closure.</p>
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