Comments on: Claudia Rosett on North Korean Loggers in Russia

By: Alec

Alec — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:58:32 +0000

Thanks for that, Jack. I recall the Gangneung emergency at the time. Which RoK parties were you suggesting?

DPRK diplomat-capitalists

I’ve had an exchange with one of the nutters in the Socialist Party of Great Britain who was arguing that the DPRK is state-capitalism.

Gawd, they’re insane.

By: Adam Cathcart

Adam Cathcart — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:05:28 +0000

According to a report in Le Monde in June 2009, the Russians were very upset with the arrogance of North Korean consular officials in Vladivostok in the aftermath of the 25 May 2009 nuclear test. So it seems logical that the local DPRK diplomat-capitalists would be getting strenuous in Vladivostok at the moment, and that they would be rebuffed. Having received their 50-year lease to two big terminals at Rajin, maybe the Russians aren't interested in doing any favors for the DPRK. And by God, that Forbes website to which you link and at which Claudia Rosett writes (well) is indeed festooned with all kinds of garbage. It makes me suddenly glad that you don't have any ads on this site.

By: kushibo

kushibo — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 17:18:15 +0000

When Hwang Jang-yop defected, North Korea had the manpower ready to go to assassinate a different high-profile defector in his apartment in the Seoul suburbs.

I had never really considered that as a major reason not to choose South Korea as a final destination, but I think it is reasonable for these defectors to fear for their safety there, at least somewhat.

Thanks for the insight, Jack.

By: Jack

Jack — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:35:22 +0000

Alec: the question is, who knows. There are certainly a myriad of forces in the ROK (heck, even major political parties) that are quite sympathetic to the DPRK. One of these parties spent nearly ten years of rule suppressing North Korea related human rights advocacy at the expense of rapprochement. Of course, that’s old hat if you read this blog.

As for real live DPRK intelligence agents operating within the ROK – I don’t doubt it. All countries spy on each other, and I think the DPRK would be foolish not to use this “sleeper agent” factor lest things go awry fast. Until the 1990′s liked to infiltrate folks via submarine until this incident kind of screwed the pooch for them (although they would try smaller operations up till at least 1998).

By: Alec

Alec — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:02:42 +0000

Yes, Jack, that was my gut-feeling, but I needed someone with personal knowledge to confirm it. Is it accurate?, rather like the various agents/sympathizers for the East German amongst the intelligensia/activist ranks in Britain.

I recall an episode of The Shield (not necessarily accurate, I know) portrayed conflict between ‘North’ and ‘South’ Koreans.

By: The_Incredible_HUK

The_Incredible_HUK — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:58:27 +0000

Not that these loggers would be aware of the following, but however much the ROK is better than the DPRK – more food, freedom, democracy, modern amenities – DPRK nationals struggle in the ROK in many ways.

As Jack said, they merely have to speak a few words for any ROK national to immediately recognize them as defectors, and other than (some) Christian groups, civic organizations, and other concerned elements (Korean War veterans), defectors are discriminated against by the ROK public. It is no surprise that many defectors in the ROK contact third-country relief organizations for help on how to relocate to such third countries, because the difficulties of life in the ROK (the aforementioned discrimination one of the biggest difficulties) are often too heavy a burden for them to bear.

By: Jack

Jack — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:46:01 +0000

Quite a few of the refugees I’ve talked to choose a third, more multicultural country due to the anonymity it affords them. In the ROK, they only need to engage in simple conversation to be identified as North Korean – in the US or Canada, it is rare to find people who can. Given that the popular perception among North Koreans is that the ROK is infested with DPRK spies, protecting their families back home (or to a certain extent, their own personal safety) may be one driver for them to choose the enemy of their enemy – rather than any new-found ideological beliefs.

By: slim

slim — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:10:35 +0000

One sad aside of this sordid tale is how Ms Rosett notes several times in passing the formerly free or democratizing nature of Russia, which seems like a by-gone era.

By: Alec

Alec — Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:39:07 +0000

In Gulag, Anne Applebaum discussed such use of 'private enterprise' in logging sites at the height of the Stalin era. Given the time-frame for *official* disbanding of the slave-camps, Kim Jong-Ryul certainly was using raised monies to buy apple strugels for Kim Jong-Sung.