Just Wondering …
If Robert Park’s “interview” with the North Koreans was coerced, why has he now missed so many opportunities to repudiate it?
If Robert Park’s “interview” with the North Koreans was coerced, why has he now missed so many opportunities to repudiate it?
I think perhaps they have something on Mr Park, maybe some Christians he knows are being held hostage. I don’t see why the North Koreans would do an interview then release him the next day if they thought he was simply going to recant everything. On the other hand he doesn’t seem like the most stable of individuals so maybe his change of heart was genuine. If we don’t hear anything out of Mr Park in the future it probably means the North Koreans have some form of assurance that he will exercise discretion.
Maybe they broke him. Let’s see how long it lasts.
We must not forget that there are still two others being held in North Korea who went in after Robert, one a South Korean copy-cat crosser and one an American. No one appears to know anything about this American, not even his name. The North Koreans said he wanted to join their military, but do you trust what they say?
Well if he weren’t coerced into saying it (assuming the words passed his lips at all), that would mean there is some truth to what he said. And we know better than that.
A lot of people mentioned the possibility that if he were to recant his statement, it could possibly cost the lives or limbs of other North Korean prisoners. If I were in such a position, having received my third-degree pwnage, I’d keep quiet as well, having caused more than enough problems already.
Uh, maybe so soon after his own ordeal from which he is probably not even partially recovered (PTSD, anyone?), he doesn’t want to be responsible for whatever happens to the Christians that were paraded in front of him as torture fodder.
Remember folks, this is the regime that treats its own families like this. Park is probably waking up in the middle of the night with panic attacks because of the things he saw and experienced among ‘the happiest people on earth.’
KCJ wrote:
Where have I heard this before? Oh, yeah…
It may be uncomfortable to admit it, but the end result of this ill-advised misadventure (unlike others here, I don’t admire passion, honesty and courage of very religous people when it’s coupled with willful stupidity and utter disregard for other people whose lives they will adversely affect) may be that Robert Park really has “turned.”
As I said before, if the Stupogantsâ„¢ can “feel kinship†with their captors at the Pyongyang Palazzo, it’s not outside the realm of possibility that Mr Park had a change of heart after attending the church along DPRK’s Disneyland Main Street. I’m not saying that’s definitely what happened, just that we shouldn’t be surprised if that’s what it turns out went down up there.
This just in, and I know you will not doubt Suzanne Scholte’s credibility:
kushibo said
15 Then the officers of the children of Israel came and cried out to Pharaoh, saying, “Why are you dealing thus with your servants? 16 There is no straw given to your servants, and they say to us, ‘Make brick!’ And indeed your servants are beaten, but the fault is in your own people.â€
17 But he said, “You are idle! Idle! Therefore you say, ‘Let us go and sacrifice to the LORD.’ 18 Therefore go now and work; for no straw shall be given you, yet you shall deliver the quota of bricks.†19 And the officers of the children of Israel saw that they were in trouble after it was said, “You shall not reduce any bricks from your daily quota.â€
20 Then, as they came out from Pharaoh, they met Moses and Aaron who stood there to meet them. 21 And they said to them, “Let the LORD look on you and judge, because you have made us abhorrent in the sight of Pharaoh and in the sight of his servants, to put a sword in their hand to kill us.â€
Exodus 5
Friends don’t let friends sneak into North Korea.
Again, not being very familiar with references to passages from Exodus 5, I have to agree with the first five here as probably the most plausible explanations, especially PTSD and as Dan O C said,
“A lot of people mentioned the possibility that if he were to recant his statement, it could possibly cost the lives or limbs of other North Korean prisoners. If I were in such a position, having received my third-degree pwnage, I’d keep quiet as well, having caused more than enough problems already. “
he didn’t get to point b.
good intentions, but obviously just didn’t have the proper plans and/or support.
but for goodness sake’s, he’s just a kid who is 28 years old and made some seriously reckless decisions.
not everyone matures at the same time and it’s easy to be monday morning quarterbacks from our comfortable keyboards.
yet i do trust Suzanne Scholte’s credibility and remarks that his statement was obviously coerced.
my take:
he was a reckless kid out of control with grandeur hopes with a strong faith in God.
from his brother’s comments that he appreciated seeing his younger brother ‘re-connect’ with his mom when he got back tells me that their relationship was ‘broken’. all 1st generation korean parents threaten to ‘break off’ the relationship when they do things that the parents do not accept.
he was a rebel and did his things his own way or the way he thought was right. (i deduce that from the Arizona pastor’s comments that it was weird to see him in a suit because he never wore a suit, including other people’s weddings. )
on top of that, there were comments right after he went in from people that knew him that he was getting a little bit ‘over the top’. they questioned his mental stability.
NK obviously broke the shit out of him and realized he was pretty weak. that’s why they released him so quickly without worry that he would recant so quickly and/or permanently damaged him.
did he have NK Christians paraded in front of him and have had their finger nails pull out with pliers? i hope not, but it wouldn’t surprise me.
maybe he has blood on his hands because they murdered NK Christians in front of him?
again, i hope not.
is a suicide next for him? i hope not.
plus he was certainly a ‘cheap’ gift to return back to the US quid pro quo for the non re-enlistment of being a terrorist country.
if there is anything half full, again, it’s the amount of publicity he created re: NK.
we might follow it everyday, but to just enlighten just one more person about how horrible NK is a success.
Do not underestimate my willingness to play devil’s advocate at at time when I think people are coming to conclusions without the facts on the ground to support them. JCS wrote:
Ms Scholte is not “convinced” he was coerced, but rather she believes this to be true. And why not? Nobody wants to believe that someone they know personally like that would say that willingly.
I’m remind how people were convinced that Laura Ling and Euna Lee hadn’t gone into DPRK territory willingly as well. I tie that in because I want to point out that the people causing headache when they end up in the hands of the DPRK authorities aren’t thinking like, well, normal people. Robert Park may indeed have a
messiahMoses complex, an indication of a less-than-clearly-thinking mind, and if that is the case, him being brainwashed is not a far-fetched notion. It’s not a given, but it’s certainly a real possibility. The words in the interview sound a little too genuine to be a parroting of what North Korean handlers want him to say. Besides, there was no “exit interview” with the Stupogants (was there?) who almost certainly would have recanted once they got to American soil, so why would the Norks pull something like that with this guy?I’m not convinced.
How come people keep saying that maybe the regime tortured other Christians in front of Park? Why just Christians? How about any person- no matter what they believe?
If the regime did torture other Christians in front of Park and threatened Park that they would continue to and/or kill them if he spoke the truth once he arrived home…well, Park would perhaps know that the believers would be in heaven if they were killed- so he might speak the truth. Better than being alive in North Korea. But if he believes they were non-believers that will be killed or tortured- then they would go to hell. Depending on what Park believes.
Although- they are already in hell.
I think that’s pure speculation.
Oh, I know it is. Theories abound!
bahahah!
Anyway, seriously though: although, Kushibo, I agree with the vast majority of what you say, I find it hard to believe you could brainwash such a zealous believer. If you were particularly scornful towards organised relgion — which I’m not, necessarily — you could argue that he was kind-of brainwashed in the first place. But…it just doesn’t seem realistic to me. Then again, I’m no expert at all — could anyone with a little more knowledge on the subject maybe shed some light on this possibility?
Poor Robert Park hasn’t said a word since his release, and look at all the speculation. Imagine if he had a media personality sibling feeding us tidbits. I’ll take Robert Park’s silence as a positive sign that his loving family is taking very good care of him at the moment and leave it at that.
Kushibo, I don’t “believe” the words sounded genuinely like Park’s as you do “believe” – however, it’s pretty clear that the public statement promulgated by the NK regime is the same old signature modus operandi used to perpetuate the myth…btw…loved your blog, Monster Island, which I browsed for the first time…just curious, why the name, Monster Island? Would you be incorporating David Woolley’s analysis in your update of dire famine concerns for spring 2010…hope so. As for Robert Park, it does seem a bit like he is the gift that keeps on giving for you…I noticed that European media refer to him as a religious “activist” while American media refer to him as a religious “missionary” – again, as I’m not that religious, does one word have any more of a negative connotation than the other?
I don’t. If — I repeat — if the reports of Park’s “confession” are true, they go directly to the distinction between a sincere religious believer from a fanatic. A believer embraces belief because he embraces life, and because belief enhances living. In his faith, he finds community with others and a moral and social structure for the life of his family. The embrace and love of life, the sense of self-worth, is why most of the ardent religious believers who take their families to church on Sunday could never become suicide bombers. They would only sacrifice themselves for people they love — their families, or their comrades in a military unit. They don’t seek out self-sacrifice as Robert Park did.
I certainly am not suggesting any moral comparison between Robert Park’s nonviolent, well-intentioned acts and suicide bombing, but I do see a similar pathology at work.
A fanatic is burdened with a sense of worthlessness that demands attachment to something greater than himself, and most dangerously, self-sacrifice for The Cause. In his landmark 1951 book, “The True Believer,” Eric Hoffer explained this, and explained how to a true fanatic, causes are fungible and interchangeable. One cause is as good as another if it fills an empty soul.
None of this is meant to condemn Park, merely to say that he is (a) distinguishable from sincere Christian believers in important ways, and (b) a man deserving of compassion, and in need of help.
Maybe Herr Park has something of a volatile, bipolar mindset and having just spend 6 weeks in North Korea, he is probably now taking their narrative ‘into consideration’…
There is probably a very simple explanation here.
Given Suzanne Scholte’s subject matter expertise and the fact that she actually knows Park personally, I would side w/her evaluation:
a) KCNA “interview†statements were coerced;
b) In good time, perhaps even a-la-upcoming-Euna-Lee-tome, he will produce a narrative about the experience.
I don’t know about the rest of you, but I’m beginning to think there’s an irrational obsession going on with respect to Robert Park – Josh, didn’t Hoffer write about “politicians” as opposed to religious believers, fanatical or otherwise? Oh well, there is indeed probably a very simple explanation here and I tend to agree with Dan O C, who put himself in Park’s position, KCJ for calling out the obvious PTSD explanation and James for calling us on Monday morning quarterbacking – couldn’t we all at one time or another gotten so frustrated with our politicians and the situation in NK that we, too, imagined going crazy over it and walking right into NK to do something about it? Confessions, anyone?
Richard, you might be right, but you just never know with folks with an unstable mindset.
I honestly wouldn’t be see surprised to see him gathering his family and friends, telling them that 1 ) NK IS actually a people’s paradise, 2) there is food for all 3) were it not for the Dear Leader’s benovolence, he would now be joining a brand new 150 day campaign bringing the revolution forward.
He may well end up like a reverse Senor Cao de Douche.
And Irene, I have actually seen the workers paradise with my own blue eyes, there was no need to enter it illegally. Waste of money by the way.
you’re right Theresa re:
“Why just Christians?”
with all my grammatical errors, hopefully you can give me the benefit of the doubt that i wrote my comments up pretty quickly and i wasn’t drunk blogging. i didn’t mean to generalize.
joshua, if you want to, please search and replace anywhere in my comment that I wrote specifically ‘NK Christians’ to ‘Christians/regime dissenters/golden retriever puppies’.
You missed the point, Ernst….obviously, you’ve not felt the frustration with our politicians in doing something about the NK crisis…or have you…it’s hard to tell from your last comment…please do elaborate! I do agree that there is no need to enter NK illegally as we have the intelligence assets to take action now – the question is why haven’t we yet?!
“couldn’t we all at one time or another gotten so frustrated with our politicians and the situation in NK that we, too, imagined going crazy over it and walking right into NK to do something about it? “
NO.
Speak for yourself, Sonagi. There are numerous passionate commentaries that express just the opposite. BTW, that was meant as a rhetorical question. Cheers!
irene:
I share that sentiment, Irene, but then again I have been called zealot, fanatic, extremist, etc… for the failure to disguise my passion about what for me is a life/death and heaven/hell issue.
If you are bored, here is a paper I wrote as an insideron the role of religion and religious leaders in Operation Iraqi Freedom.
I think you bring a much needed balance to this discussion amid all the adroit just-the-facts-ma’am opining. I’m personally glad you are here.
kcj
KCJ, My whole point through this discussion is that you’re an entirely different kind of person than a fanatic, zealot, or extremist. That you share some of Robert Park’s religious beliefs is merely incidental. You value life. Robert Park craved self-sacrifice.
Speak for yourself, Sonagi.
An ironic retort given the use of “we” in your, um, rhetorical question. Nothing rhetorical about Park’s incursion and the consequences that followed.
KCJ,
Needless to say, we are so grateful for your service to our country and moreso because of your exceptionalism – the paper which you wrote as well as the insight you provided on the Juche religion is impressive and will serve you well as you continue your leadership in all areas of the military – and on a personal note, thanks for appreciating me and yes, I’m glad to be here, too.
Robert Park is not home and is being treated by several doctors, which gives support to the explanation forwarded by Suzanne Scholte and yours truly.
Park’s gaunt appearance, fallen countenance and baffling pro-DPRK ‘confession’ have lent to some of us clues that point to some kind of torture, brain washing or duress during his 43 day foray into the most hostile place on earth to be a Christian.
(3rd try in getting this text posted; you can remove the possible previous versions, Joshua)A BIG HEART’S CRY
Please, bear with me. I know it’s kind of a read for you guys, but please hear me out.
I’ve also read all your comments regarding Robert Park, also in the other articles on this site, and I’d like to join in now for a moment, if you’ll allow me.
Joshua wrote:
Joshua, I thank you for your site, and your heart for the Korean people. I have been visiting your site for a long period of time now, and have always appreciated it much. BUT…
… as far as your comments regarding Robert Park and ‘fanatic Christians’ as a whole are concerned, I have the feeling that at this point in your life you cannot actually feel what it is for a christian (i.e. a lover of Jesus Christ) to have his brothers and sisters being under the hammer every goddamn day. (we feel they’re our brothers and sisters because to some extent the love of Jesus Christ has mold our hearts over the years, so that we can feel* (only partly, unfortunately) the suffering of others – BTW, this is not to say that we’re more special than you or other non-Christians, but that Christ is special!!; for he can do that with any (wo-)man that will let Him)
*) ‘If one member suffers, all the members suffer with it’, 1 Corinthians 12 verses 25-26.
FEEL THEIR PAIN
Maybe you can feel with me, the devastation when someone close to you (think about a child you care for) has been raped and been horribly mutilated, or brought down to their young-age grave. I think you would feel a deep pain, a pain that cannot hold back big aching tears at some tough moments.
Then – when trying to imagine that kind of feeling – you should multiply that deep crying feeling with 3, 5, 10 or more times – to the point where tears will NOT BE ENOUGH to relieve you from this big aching pain inside. Try to imagine such a state you will then be in, and you will come close to what people like Robert Park feel when confronted with the daily lives of his hammered down brothers and sisters** in this dark land, the DPRK.
**) brothers and sisters in spirit, of course, but feeling as close as one’s own kin, if not closer – since they have to suffer so hard.
Some of us – and clearly Robert Park is one of them – would want to give up their own life if it would free e.g. 1, 2, …, 10 or 20 brothers and sisters from these camps***. Robert Park even wanted to risk his own precious life (held precious to himself as well !!, because he planned to have a wife and kids, as he stated in the Reuters interview) for the mere awareness it would create in the world (that for the most part is still deaf – or gone deaf – for the real NK issues, which are the camps IMO).
***) This is, of course, not a recommendation, because the North Korean regime is not to be trusted in these kinds of schemes, and would maybe simply exchange other North Koreans, possibly security agents.
GOING CRAZY
Some people have called Robert Park crazy to even come up with such an act as he did on Christmas Day 2009.
But I think, ‘going crazy’ cannot be Robert’s crime, since anyone who’s not going crazy a bit after confronted with the horrors of the DPRK either has a stone heart, or doesn’t yet fully understand what these people are going through day after day, and so maybe s/he should contemplate on this more.
Remember: Jesus was also called crazy, even by His own followers at first, for moving in the direction of letting Himself being crucified (i.e. not get out of the way of His vicious enemies any longer – since the time of His 3-year teaching was fulfilled).
The act of (agape-) love makes one crazy to this world, where selfishness is prio number one.
But there’s a better world to come (and is already there, although not with eyes to see), in which there’s real justice, and where love rules.
Robert Park showed us a peek into that world.
FANATIC
Maybe you have a different definition for the word ‘fanatic’ than I have.
For me ‘fanatic’ in regard to people like Robert Park means: a person, very touched by the life-changing, true love advocating words of Jesus Christ, and willing to go forward with it even if it will put an end to your cozy life big time. In short, ‘fanatic christian’ for me reads like: ‘a person that’s extremely passionate in loving people, as in: caring for people’.
And remember with it, that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself as a real martyr****, i.e. he stood up for the sake of true -agape kind of- love, and got brutally murdered for it. He never meant to sacrifice Himself for the sake of fighting some holy war – by killing other people, and never told us humans to do so either.
****) so very much unlike the misguided individuals indoctrinated by some hateful Muslim leaders who’ve been telling tales to young people, so that they will sacrifice their precious(!!) lives TO KILL OTHER INNOCENT LIVES.
CRAVING SELF-SACRIFICE
You wrote:
As I hope you can read from my words above, I think Robert Park does value life, and does not crave self-sacrifice. I believe his brother Paul was saying he misses his brother’s LOVE so much. So, he was a caring, loving christian, who, I believe, was also helping poor Mexicans a lot the last couple of years. So, ‘fanatic’ in the right sense, or…does anyone disagree?
I think that when he entered, he hoped to come out alive someday, BUT if it could relieve the hurt of his brothers and sisters in the camps of the DPRK, he would be willing to lay down his life for them – as Christ once did, as well as some of His heartfelt followers – in the past days of Christianity, as well as in this day and age by Christians inside the camps of the DPRK (read Soon Ok Lee’s book ‘The Eyes of the Tailless Animals’ on it).
Robert Park, IMO, could not be content anymore with people and constitutions talking and talking, and helping a few here and there (albeit a very worthy task, don’t get me wrong here, but that’s what it looks on the big scale; and I do admire people like e.g. Mr. Chun Ki-won a lot for one, for risking his own life to save lots of refugees; but everyone has to do what he feels is most pressing to him/her, and, of course, helping hundreds of refugees, although a very very big and difficult effort, will maybe ‘bring down the NK gulag’ in the long(er) run, but not this month or this year, I guess; while the people in the camps are being mutilated every day – as we are ventilating our thoughts… Please, let’s not forget that! )
It seems that because of the slowness (inevitable or through laziness/selfishness) of the ‘liberation of NK’-process that Robert Park took ‘sacrifice road’ as a somewhat desperate but determined move – in the hope that it would create a much deeper awareness, up to this world’s political thrones; and I personally believe his loving act will have done and will do more harm to the NK regime and its lies in the name of Juche than we can all imagine)
A CRY TO THE WORLD…
Robert Park’s operation was not a military operation. Maybe it was not thoroughly planned and executed according to that plan, nor was it backed up by consensus in the entire world (of (divided) Christians?). It was a desperate plea to the world: PLEASE SAVE THESE GENTLE MEN, WOMEN AND CHILDREN THAT ARE BEING SAVAGED EVERY DAY !!!
Hope you will now be able to feel some of what this man, this Robert Park, has gone through, and still is going through – and he could use our support…
Let’s keep up the good fight for a Free DPRK. Those people need us desperately!
And let’s help each-other in the fight as much as we can, although we don’t always agree fully on the methods used.
God bless you!
— David
davidkohannah.wordpress.com
If Mr. Park would have been a sane individual, he’d probably didn’t have to see any doctor. After all, he spend less time in NK than these irresponsible US journalists and they didn’t need to see any doctor.
Then KJC says, that doctorS, plural, are looking after him. That tells me that Mr. Park is probably not only high maintenance but clearly confused.
As I said before, I wouldn’t be surprised him really believing all this garbage that the north Koreans have been feeding him. He’s probably telling his doctors right now, ‘that hospital treatment is free in NK and you imperialist doctors are charging me for it !!”
Good luck to him getting DeJuchefied.
Good grief, Ernst…is that the best you can do? I think KCJ said it best: “To those who say Park wasn’t beaten – where is your evidence?”
Well, where is your evidence that he WAS beaten ? No one can say for sure.
All we have as ‘evidence’ are some video clips where we can hear Mr. Park speak and on these tapes he clearly sounds as vain as he sounds deluded.
And now, when he is back, he needs an army of doctors looking after him – most probably psychiatrists rather than nurses looking after his sore toe.
Now, don’t act all “holier than thou” Ernst when you read this, OK?
Again, credits are due to KCJ:
http://proctor2004.bravejournal.com/entry/50195
Irene, I see KCJ has become your very own KJI eh…. Follow the leader.
But so far I still haven’t seen a good argument why I am wrong.
And sorry, God’s love and all that is not a good argument.
If Mr. Park would have been a sane individual, he’d probably didn’t have to see any doctor. After all, he spend less time in NK than these irresponsible US journalists and they didn’t need to see any doctor.
No one – not me, not you, no one who is reading this – would know with any certainty how they would react to torture and/or brainwashing. You may think you’re a strong-minded individual, but that’s no guarantee that you too wouldn’t crack under pressure. Even those who have been trained to resist such measures might find it difficult, don’t you think? And I am sure that Mr. Park had no such training. It’s got nothing to do with sanity/insanity.
Sanity is no fool-proof safeguard against torture and/or brainwashing.
Ha, ha…was that a personal attack? Again, you missed the point, Ernst. It’s the nature of the evidence, not the messenger, that matters…and KCJ’s “evidence” has been around a lot longer than anything you seem to rely on.
Joshua, about three hours ago I’ve posted a long comment on this page, and your site seemed to have accepted it, but it hasn’t appeared yet on the page. Could you see if it’s still somewhere in the pipeline, or should I try to post it again?
— David
Well-said, j. lee…did not get to read what you wrote until after responding to ernst’s last point. I’m sure most reasonable people would agree with your analysis.
A BIG HEART’S CRY
Please, bear with me. I know it’s kind of a read for you guys, but please hear me out.
I’ve also read all your comments regarding Robert Park, also in the other articles on this site, and I’d like to join in now for a moment, if you’ll allow me.
Joshua wrote:
Joshua, I thank you for your site, and your heart for the Korean people. I have been visiting your site for a long period of time now, and have always appreciated it much. BUT…
… as far as your comments regarding Robert Park and ‘fanatic Christians’ as a whole are concerned, I have the feeling that at this point in your life you cannot actually feel what it is for a christian (i.e. a lover of Jesus Christ) to have his brothers and sisters being under the hammer every goddamn day. (we feel they’re our brothers and sisters because to some extent the love of Jesus Christ has mold our hearts over the years, so that we can feel* (only partly, unfortunately) the suffering of others – BTW, this is not to say that we’re more special than you or other non-Christians, but that Christ is special!!; for he can do that with any (wo-)man that will let Him)
*) ‘If one member suffers, all the members suffer with it’, 1 Corinthians 12 verses 25-26.
FEEL THEIR PAIN
Maybe you can feel with me, the devastation when someone close to you (think about a child you care for) has been raped and been horribly mutilated, or brought down to their young-age grave. I think you would feel a deep pain, a pain that cannot hold back big aching tears at some tough moments.
Then – when trying to imagine that kind of feeling – you should multiply that deep crying feeling with 3, 5, 10 or more times – to the point where tears will NOT BE ENOUGH to relieve you from this big aching pain inside. Try to imagine such a state you will then be in, and you will come close to what people like Robert Park feel when confronted with the daily lives of his hammered down brothers and sisters** in this dark land, the DPRK.
**) brothers and sisters in spirit, of course, but feeling as close as one’s own kin, if not closer – since they have to suffer so hard.
Some of us – and clearly Robert Park is one of them – would want to give up their own life if it would free e.g. 1, 2, …, 10 or 20 brothers and sisters from these camps***. Robert Park even wanted to risk his own precious life (held precious to himself as well !!, because he planned to have a wife and kids, as he stated in the Reuters interview) for the mere awareness it would create in the world (that for the most part is still deaf – or gone deaf – for the real NK issues, which are the camps IMO).
***) This is, of course, not a recommendation, because the North Korean regime is not to be trusted in these kinds of schemes, and would maybe simply exchange other North Koreans, possibly security agents.
GOING CRAZY
Some people have called Robert Park crazy to even come up with such an act as he did on Christmas Day 2009.
But I think, ‘going crazy’ cannot be Robert’s crime, since anyone who’s not going crazy a bit after confronted with the horrors of the DPRK either has a stone heart, or doesn’t yet fully understand what these people are going through day after day, and so maybe s/he should contemplate on this more.
Remember: Jesus was also called crazy, even by His own followers at first, for moving in the direction of letting Himself being crucified (i.e. not get out of the way of His vicious enemies any longer – since the time of His 3-year teaching was fulfilled).
The act of (agape-) love makes one crazy to this world, where selfishness is prio number one.
But there’s a better world to come (and is already there, although not with eyes to see), in which there’s real justice, and where love rules.
Robert Park showed us a peek into that world.
FANATIC
Maybe you have a different definition for the word ‘fanatic’ than I have.
For me ‘fanatic’ in regard to people like Robert Park means: a person, very touched by the life-changing, true love advocating words of Jesus Christ, and willing to go forward with it even if it will put an end to your cozy life big time. In short, ‘fanatic christian’ for me reads like: ‘a person that’s extremely passionate in loving people, as in: caring for people’.
And remember with it, that Jesus Christ sacrificed Himself as a real martyr****, i.e. he stood up for the sake of true -agape kind of- love, and got brutally murdered for it. He never meant to sacrifice Himself for the sake of fighting some holy war – by killing other people, and never told us humans to do so either.
****) so very much unlike the misguided individuals indoctrinated by some hateful Muslim leaders who’ve been telling tales to young people, so that they will sacrifice their precious(!!) lives TO KILL OTHER INNOCENT LIVES.
CRAVING SELF-SACRIFICE
You wrote:
As I hope you can read from my words above, I think Robert Park does value life, and does not crave self-sacrifice. I believe his brother Paul was saying he misses his brother’s LOVE so much. So, he was a caring, loving christian, who, I believe, was also helping poor Mexicans a lot the last couple of years. So, ‘fanatic’ in the right sense, or…does anyone disagree?
I think that when he entered, he hoped to come out alive someday, BUT if it could relieve the hurt of his brothers and sisters in the camps of the DPRK, he would be willing to lay down his life for them – as Christ once did, as well as some of His heartfelt followers – in the past days of Christianity, as well as in this day and age by Christians inside the camps of the DPRK (read Soon Ok Lee’s book ‘The Eyes of the Tailless Animals’ on it).
Robert Park, IMO, could not be content anymore with people and constitutions talking and talking, and helping a few here and there (albeit a very worthy task, don’t get me wrong here, but that’s what it looks on the big scale; and I do admire people like e.g. Mr. Chun Ki-won a lot for one, for risking his own life to save lots of refugees; but everyone has to do what he feels is most pressing to him/her, and, of course, helping hundreds of refugees, although a very very big and difficult effort, will maybe ‘bring down the NK gulag’ in the long(er) run, but not this month or this year, I guess; while the people in the camps are being mutilated every day – as we are ventilating our thoughts… Please, let’s not forget that! )
It seems that because of the slowness (inevitable or through laziness/selfishness) of the ‘liberation of NK’-process that Robert Park took ‘sacrifice road’ as a somewhat desperate but determined move – in the hope that it would create a much deeper awareness, up to this world’s political thrones; and I personally believe his loving act will have done and will do more harm to the NK regime and its lies in the name of Juche than we can all imagine)
A CRY TO THE WORLD…
Robert Park’s operation was not a military operation. Maybe it was not thoroughly planned and executed according to that plan, nor was it backed up by consensus in the entire world (of (divided) Christians?). It was a desperate plea to the world: PLEASE SAVE THESE GENTLE MEN, WOMEN AND CHILDREN THAT ARE BEING SAVAGED EVERY DAY !!!
Hope you will now be able to feel some of what this man, this Robert Park, has gone through, and still is going through – and he could use our support…
Let’s keep up the good fight for a Free DPRK. Those people need us desperately!
And let’s help each-other in the fight as much as we can, although we don’t always agree fully on the methods used.
God bless you!
— David
davidkohannah.wordpress.com
David, what a longwinded story, do you really expect people to read all that drivel ? I could have figured out myself that Bobby’s walk into NK wasn’t a military action.
And as for my beloved antagonist Irene, I actually don’t get your points, but I’m sure ‘holier than thou’ will sit with you very good indeed.
Robert Park is shamefully embarrassed having fallen for the imperialist aggressor’s evil propaganda. The DPRK is the one true democracy on this planet. People enjoy living there and cry when they realize how lucky they are to live in a socialist people’s paradise!
At February 12, 2010 @ 1:02 pm I wrote:
Now I can see my post has been inserted at February 12, 2010 @ 9:46 am after all, Joshua, so I guess it was probably held up during the reviewing process. Thanks for allowing the complete comment.
— David
Feelings are mutual, Ernst..btw, Katja’s comments are directed to you, out of all the commenters here.
At Ernst:
You wrote:
Hi Ernst, it was probably meant for people that are open enough to learn about the real reasons behind Robert Park’s thinking – as far as I can judge him, but I think I come close – and it seems you’re not one of them, as you rather like to write than to read (my honest opinion after having been exposed to lots of your comments on Robert Park the last month or so). I wonder, Ernst, if you are at all interested in what happens to the poor people of North Korea. It seems like all you wanna do is scorn people, especially Christians. What’s actually bothering you, man? I mean, what’s at the core of your resentment?
And then you wrote:
Is that the only line you’ve actually read, or found important enough to comment on?
I can see you’re a man that cuts to the core 🙁
Maybe next time you’ll be picking on some word I didn’t spell right.
And all while the suffering in the camps continues…
— David
I have scrolled this thread up and down now twice, and I don’t see any posts by Katja, so can’t comment on whatever advise she might have for yours truly. Irene is probably pulling a plonker here.
And Mr David, your comments re fanatics are quite something, I wonder whether you might be one yourself ? I hope not, because otherwise Pepsi better double its prize money to get both you and Bobby treated. After all, you wrote :
For me ‘fanatic’ in regard to people like Robert Park means: a person, very touched by the life-changing, true love advocating words of Jesus Christ, and willing to go forward with it even if it will put an end to your cozy life big time. In short, ‘fanatic christian’ for me reads like: ‘a person that’s extremely passionate in loving people, as in: caring for people’.
If you ask me, that sounds as scary as having Senor Cao de Douche living next door.
By the same token and to bring some perspective :
A lot of folks in the Arab world are touched by the life-changing, true love advocating words of Mohammed and are willing to sacrifice their cozy life…… just so they can blow up you and me on the subway.
Very passionate indeed, but you end up paying for it with your life.
And Bobby has probably compromized people’s lives, perhaps even the Koreans in NK who curiously asked him what the hell he was doing there after just crossing the border.
Nothing against your religion, and nothing against Rene’s feministic streak, just thought to make that clear !
But you still need a reality check though.
Ernst, I don’t mean to be condescending, but did it ever occur to you that her comments may not be in this thread? All you had to do was ask…hint: search for Joshua’s post on a KCNA report of Robert Park’s torture this was posted prior to his “release”.